Grinding or not grinding... that's the question

Games with combat, inventory, crafting and more beside a story and dating/life sim gameplay
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jack1974
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Re: Grinding or not grinding... that's the question

Post by jack1974 »

Well even in Loren you could grind, but you really had no reason to do it unless you were playing in Hard mode :wink:
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Jaeger
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Re: Grinding or not grinding... that's the question

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In Loren, battles don't yield a whole lot of XP and the loot isn't always that great either. It's an option, but I don't think it's worth the tedium for the most part. At least you don't have to run around and wait for random battles if you do need to grind.

Planet Stronghold, had finite encounters, there was no way to over-level. The problem though was because XP gained from battle is limited to participating party members, some party members can be left in the dust if you don't use them with equal frequency. Under leveled characters can be a liability if they are forced to be in your party for any reason.
Last edited by Jaeger on Tue Jul 02, 2013 7:04 am, edited 3 times in total.
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jack1974
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Re: Grinding or not grinding... that's the question

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Yes true, I think the main problem of Loren was that (as a reviewer pointed out) the weapons didn't make MUCH difference. Yes they made some, but not enough to justify the bother of grinding for them. So you would grind more to gain levels, more HP/SP and of course, new skills. In the next RPG I want to address this issue by making the weapons have more impact.
In PS, you could level up the skills of the less used characters with the training center, but yes there could be some that were "left behind" a bit :lol:
P_Tigras
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Re: Grinding or not grinding... that's the question

Post by P_Tigras »

jack1974 wrote:Yes true, I think the main problem of Loren was that (as a reviewer pointed out) the weapons didn't make MUCH difference. Yes they made some, but not enough to justify the bother of grinding for them. So you would grind more to gain levels, more HP/SP and of course, new skills. In the next RPG I want to address this issue by making the weapons have more impact.
In PS, you could level up the skills of the less used characters with the training center, but yes there could be some that were "left behind" a bit :lol:
Weapons made a difference on the Hard level, but on the Normal difficulty level they weren't much of a consideration. I easily played through the normal level without buying a single item in a shop.
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jack1974
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Re: Grinding or not grinding... that's the question

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Ah ok. I was speaking in Hard level instead. And yes, in Normal level you could finish the whole game without buying anything. I definitely need also to add more difficulty levels in the next games (I think with PS1 the difficulty was better balanced).
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Re: Grinding or not grinding... that's the question

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jack1974 wrote:Ah ok. I was speaking in Hard level instead. And yes, in Normal level you could finish the whole game without buying anything. I definitely need also to add more difficulty levels in the next games (I think with PS1 the difficulty was better balanced).
The problems with weapons on the hard level were twofold. First, aside from heavy crossbows/bows which were restricted to thieves, there wasn't sufficient variety/availability in most other weapon categories of every damage type. There was usually one weapon that was the best, and then another that was its equal or nearly so, but after that the pickings became slim. So for warriors, you usually had one weapon that you used 90% of the time, and a second weapon you used for the tough fights where the bad guys were immune to the first damage type.

The second issue is that swapping out weapons for every warrior and thief for every fight was a pain in the backside. So if you could win a fight without swapping them out, you did so. And usually you could. It would have been easier if you could pre-set several weapon/equipment configurations ahead of time, and then depending upon the situation, with one key press or mouse click have your entire party equip the appropriate weapons and items. I found that I needed more healing when I didn't swap out weapons, but that was easily solved by keeping Myrth in the party, and that was less hassle than continually swapping out weapons and other special items for almost every fight.
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jack1974
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Re: Grinding or not grinding... that's the question

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Ah interesting, discovered some new things today :)
For PS2 we're going with the XCOM approach, so you can't carry a truck of items with you but you need to choose. For Loren2... well, when I'll start working on that, I'll think about it :lol:
For SOTW instead need to take into consideration what you said especially at harder difficulty...
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Re: Grinding or not grinding... that's the question

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jack1974 wrote:Ah interesting, discovered some new things today :)
For PS2 we're going with the XCOM approach, so you can't carry a truck of items with you but you need to choose. For Loren2... well, when I'll start working on that, I'll think about it :lol:
For SOTW instead need to take into consideration what you said especially at harder difficulty...
If you could create memorization shortcuts for SOTW like shift-F1 to memorize your current configuration as weapon/shield configuration 1, and F1 to equip it that would be great. A bit more work would be creating the ability to set and select between several possible party weapon/shield configurations in the inventory screen.
Last edited by P_Tigras on Mon Jul 01, 2013 6:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
at-a-glance
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Re: Grinding or not grinding... that's the question

Post by at-a-glance »

In PS1 I used Phillip’s mission (the Apex lair) for grinding, a lot. Nelson and Phillip were necessary for the mission and even after I leveled those two all the way up the experience points were divided four ways among the party. Has there been any discussion of tweaking that in future games so excess experience points in combat go to party members who haven’t already reach the level cap? In Loren it wasn’t necessary because grind was so much easier, but if PS2 is going to be similar with limited number of spots where grinding is possible it would be a nice addition. Just something to think about. :)
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jack1974
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Re: Grinding or not grinding... that's the question

Post by jack1974 »

P_Tigras wrote: If you could create memorization shortcuts for SOTW like shift-F1 to memorize your current configuration as weapon/shield configuration 1, and F1 to equip it that would be great. A bit more work would be creating the ability to set and select between several possible party weapon/shield configurations.
I think both should be possible, will check it in next days :)
at-a-glance wrote:In PS1 I used Phillip’s mission (the Apex lair) for grinding, a lot. Nelson and Phillip were necessary for the mission and even after I leveled those two all the way up the experience points were divided four ways among the party. Has there been any discussion of tweaking that in future games so excess experience points in combat go to party members who haven’t already reach the level cap? In Loren it wasn’t necessary because grind was so much easier, but if PS2 is going to be similar with limited number of spots where grinding is possible it would be a nice addition. Just something to think about. :)
I think the current idea is to have grinding offer not much XP, but more powerful equipment and/or money to buy better equipment. Or there could still be a level cap, but based on some points of the story. For example:
beginning -> until key point of the story 1 = you can level up skills up to tier 1
beginning -> until key point of the story 2 = you can level up skills up to tier 2
beginning -> until key point of the story 3 = you can level up skills up to tier 3
this way it would be possible maybe in Easy/Normal mode to not reach the level cap for the next "key point", so playing in Hard mode it would be needed/suggested. This system would let me balance the fight much better since I would know exactly which skills the players CANNOT use in certain battles :wink: something I couldn't really tell in Loren.
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