yayswords
Aug 18, 2014
Aye well if we add that one in unlimited supply I will buy it for everyone (maybe not Krimm) and forget about even looking at other necklaces until act 3. The other predefined items aren't like that. I would check randomly generated items hoping to find upgrades.
fabulaparva
Aug 18, 2014
About the necklace maybe nerf it down a little? well, is just a slot anyway, probably is OK 
Given the new, more up-to-power pricing, I don't think it needs to be nerfed. Most players won't have money to buy that necklace for every character, not to mention the whole set. Also I'd totally run out of money
if and when I want to buy other equipment for the characters as well (I don't think it's possible to beat the game by wearing only jewellery and no decent armour <insertCensoredCommentAboutTheBathhouseHere> )
yayswords
Aug 18, 2014
Most players won't have money to buy that necklace for every character
I guess that's a good point. Isn't income even nerfed now with the changed merc drops? Fewer items if yet higher quality.
renke_
Aug 18, 2014
I still think the necklace is freaking amazing though. I could roulette items superior to all the others, but that one? I'd be very hard pressed.
I though it should be impossible to random regen wear anymore?
About the necklace maybe nerf it down a little?
Given the new, more up-to-power pricing, I don't think it needs to be nerfed.
removing the other attributes (magic, speed, etc) would be a simple way - you have either regen in this slot or some other [random] bonus; but never both (excluding the real unique items)
yayswords
Aug 18, 2014
I though it should be impossible to random regen wear anymore?
Yeah that doesn't make random items more comparable to it does it :D
Under the current system, I could possibly generate something as good (more SPR less stats). With the new system, it would be pointless to even try unless you're swimming in mana and don't care for the SPR. But I like it from the PoV that it rewards good economy management.
jack1974
Aug 18, 2014
Most players won't have money to buy that necklace for every character
I guess that's a good point. Isn't income even nerfed now with the changed merc drops? Fewer items if yet higher quality.
Yes true, also considering this, the necklace is OK as it is. I am not sure honestly how much impact the new drop system has, but I guess you'd get less money overall reselling the items now
renke_
Aug 18, 2014
Aye well if we add that one in unlimited supply I will buy it for everyone (maybe not Krimm) and forget about even looking at other necklaces until act 3. The other predefined items aren't like that. I would check randomly generated items hoping to find upgrades.
I don't see a useful way to solve this - regen (especially the mana type) is the most exciting stat for items, and I think it shouldn't be available only for the lucky (or persistant
) few. The +2/+4 necklaces are kind of extreme, but if we want a game with mana refill lower values are not that helpful.
Now I don't know what will happen in act 3 - if the story will provide more unique (maybe even char-specific) quest items with regen downgrading the act 2 necklaces to +1/+2 (as a first cheap fix, later drug doses will be more expensive ^^) are a possibility. If there are no (or only a few) regen items later on +2/+4 is still an interesting feat.
A different type of game would be lower regen rates even more, the song is already nerfed and most (all?) of the other skills give fixed amounts of SP. If this is wanted all the fixed jewelry should be removed.
jack1974
Aug 18, 2014
Now I don't know what will happen in act 3 - if the story will provide more unique (maybe even char-specific) quest items with regen downgrading the act 2 necklaces to +1/+2 (as a first cheap fix, later drug doses will be more expensive ^^) are a possibility. If there are no (or only a few) regen items later on +2/+4 is still an interesting feat.
I didn't create anything yet, but in ACT3 several characters (don't remember if ALL of them, but many) should get their "ultimate weapon". Though I wanted to ask what people think about this. I mean in the story they should be their ultimate weapon, but if for player is bad, they could simply be a very good weapon and you can find something better in last act. Though the last one is a bit shorter (even if I added several side-quests, I'm going to see if I have time to implement them all).
A different type of game would be lower regen rates even more, the song is already nerfed and most (all?) of the other skills give fixed amounts of SP. If this is wanted all the fixed jewelry should be removed.
Nah, the SPRegen right now are a "problem" because makes the game too easy for hardcore players like yaysword. But I think I know his kind of strategy, in practice (I think he even said it himself) as long as can SPRegen, can cast heals, so the battles last long but can be eventually won. In ACT3 I'm making a good use of the new AI, not in all battles but in many, and sometimes just having unlimited SP won't be enough to automatically win all battles.
So far the enemies never resurrect/heal properly, never switch places, never cast buff/debuffs, never dispel/cure their negative debuff, and never steal HP or SP with their attacks, but things are going to change in act 3
Like this:
http://i.imgur.com/6fNWHSA.jpg" style="max-width:100%">
yayswords
Aug 18, 2014
I think you misunderstand. As long as I have some SPR, I can make sure to start "the next battle" on practically full health/mana. That doesn't necessarily mean I play conservatively/defensively to win the current battle (some fights I would lose playing like that). That just happens when there's only one opponent left alive.
I mentioned you needing to do something extreme to stop me, and that would be: Every encounter is now one lone monster who never runs out of mana
Screenshot: Ouch
maybe Energy Transfer will be a good idea while guarding Riley...
jack1974
Aug 18, 2014
Of course that "0 mana thing" happens only in a specific battle
but now enemies have SP drain attacks too and in general are smarter. Can't do much about the mana-dance at end of the fight though. An option could be that after a certain amount of turns the lone enemy flees and you miss the XP though probably would be too bastard
yayswords
Aug 18, 2014
Well you can do that, but I will count turns and regen as much as possible still
or leave 2 alive...
renke_
Aug 18, 2014
I hope your not on a crusade agaist usable mana in general
Skill usage is imho an integral part of your combat system, if you have the (certainly fun) ambition to stop the efficiency of regen and dancing lessons completely I vote for removing all mana management methods instead of encounters designed primary around draining the SP pool.
jack1974
Aug 18, 2014
No no, don't worry was joking
fabulaparva
Aug 19, 2014
Just for the fun of it, I tweaked a couple of items on the armours sheet, just to make it manually a tad more varied. Changes in bold. Also made up some silly names and descriptions for the items, although I guess those won't show up since the items aren't unique. This can be freely trashed. If you like what you see,I can tweak around a couple more items to stand out from the average figures, but I didn't want to changes them all because of high risk of wasted time, lol.
link for downloading the edited ods.file:
link expired
jack1974
Aug 19, 2014
Nice job, now there's only left to customize a bit the names of the items
renke_
Aug 19, 2014
one of the edged weapons should be called Blade No 3 (Mass-produced by an unimaginative but prolific dwarfish tribe.)
fabulaparva
Aug 19, 2014
Lol..just lol!
Good thing I had set my teacup down before reading that.
Do you want to take care more of naming the weapons, renke, or shall I play around with those, too?
(Now I'm tempted to name one of the daggers as Mamba No 5 (Imbued with a little bit of every stat makes it your knife)
renke_
Aug 19, 2014
I included some of yayswords ideas (excluding categories currently not used, like the warhammer) ->
http://datamining-fuer-anfaenger.de/foo/items/fixed_items_attempt2_tweaked_v2.ods
I'm not sure about the max length of the description, though - the paragraph-long lore for the fake ember sword is impossible without more screen estate, but even the short variant (first sentence or so) is unlikely in the current layout.
But this is a job for Jack, we provide only the content
Do you want to take care more of naming the weapons, renke, or shall I play around with those, too?
Uploading the sheet(s) to Google Docs would probably the best - but the current chaotic process is much more fun ^^
jack1974
Aug 19, 2014
I'm not sure about the max length of the description, though - the paragraph-long lore for the fake ember sword is impossible without more screen estate, but even the short variant (first sentence or so) is unlikely in the current layout.
For those unique items, I'm going to add a ? or
button that once clicked pops-up a window with the texts, so there shouldn't be space problems. Of course I don't think there's the need to write a long poem for EVERY item!! 