Winter Wolves - The Curse Of Mantras - Undead Lily gameplay reboot

jack1974 Apr 09, 2016

I thought to make another thread since the old one could be confusing... :lol:

So, the game now it's a RPG, and has a "world map":

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CflKWPeWcAAJY7B.jpg:large" style="max-width:100%">

which is beautiful!

In practice without spoiling anything of the story you'll have to fight battles in the 6 elemental "regions" (Life, Death, Fire, Water, Air, Nature/Earth).

Each region will of course have specific enemies (the original avatars designed for the card game).

Of course it's early design stage so ANYTHING can change, but the current idea is:

1) Even if it's a RPG, you'll be able to bring max 3 characters/heroes on each battle. They don't fight directly but can "cast spells" and summon creatures related to their alignment. We're thinking of course how to avoid "Lily/Ace must always be in party", since we want to give freedom. So an alternative could be that you can summon any unlocked creature, and the characters you choose will only influence the spells.

2) There are 72 creatures made in total, so we're thinking at first you start with 1-2 creatures for each character. Fighting battles will allow you to "collect" creatures. Sort of Pokemon

You'll be able to collect resources for each element, and they can be used either to summon creatures in battles, or to level up the creatures. Each individual creature should gain XP and level up in battle

3) The central castle will be the "hub" where all the "camp talk" takes place. The main "flow" will be a round of talks, then you'll need to do some battles to free parts of the 6 regions, and then talk again. Repeat until the final boss/battle.

I am quite confident that this system, mixed with the very original setting, and the great art (and music/writing) will make this game one of my best games so far. We'll see if that's true :lol:

DarkWolf Apr 09, 2016

While I liked the idea of a card game system I must admit that I like this one even more and from what I know of story I think that this gameplay system might be even more fitting for a story. You are also probably going to get lots of points from all monster colleting game fans.

That map looks really great, true is castle going to change depending on whatever you play as order or chaos? Looks a bit too dark now too be a base of forces of order.

jack1974 Apr 09, 2016

The castle is "neutral"

though maybe I can look into making it change based on alignment, might be a fun idea.

Callista Apr 09, 2016

I wanted to say as well how much I like that the gameplay is going to be a RPG. I love battling and that world map looks beautiful. I'll be keeping an eye out for this. ^^

Exizel Apr 09, 2016

While I liked the idea of a card game system I must admit that I like this one even more and from what I know of story I think that this gameplay system might be even more fitting for a story. You are also probably going to get lots of points from all monster colleting game fans.

That map looks really great, true is castle going to change depending on whatever you play as order or chaos? Looks a bit too dark now too be a base of forces of order.

order=/=good and chaos=/=evil, Saying that the castle is too dark for the force the order makes no sense, I want to avoid the "force of order are good and the force of chaos are evil" thing.

Both order and chaos have good and bad side

exemple of the bad side of order:"killing or put in a jail someone because he/she has a different opinion/religion/etc.. that is against the country's law"

exemple of the good side of chaos:"freedom of expression and liberty to choose what you want to do with your life"

Those exemples are oversimplify and extreme but it justs to give an idea.

Edit:I forgot to comment ,on the news,I love the world and the idea for the batlle system,

I have to says it is that now with this battle system, the main character don't feel like heroes but god summoning their heroes

jack1974 Apr 09, 2016

Yes true, it was the writer who suggested to change from evil/good to order/chaos

so I have to give him merit for this!

DarkWolf Apr 09, 2016

While I liked the idea of a card game system I must admit that I like this one even more and from what I know of story I think that this gameplay system might be even more fitting for a story. You are also probably going to get lots of points from all monster colleting game fans.

That map looks really great, true is castle going to change depending on whatever you play as order or chaos? Looks a bit too dark now too be a base of forces of order.

order=/=good and chaos=/=evil, Saying that the castle is too dark for the force the order makes no sense, I want to avoid the "force of order are good and the force of chaos are evil" thing.

Both order and chaos have good and bad side

exemple of the bad side of order:"killing or put in a jail someone because he/she has a different opinion/religion/etc.. that is against the country's law"

exemple of the good side of chaos:"freedom of expression and liberty to choose what you want to do with your life"

Those exemples are oversimplify and extreme but it justs to give an idea.

Edit:I forgot to comment ,on the news,I love the world and the idea for the batlle system,

I have to says it is that now with this battle system, the main character don't feel like heroes but god summoning their heroes

I didn't say that castle looks too evil for force of order but that it looks too dark, dark and evil/bad are not the same thing and based on characters art I did get impression that chaos is more of a dark style while order is more of a light, but light =/=good and chaos =/=evil.

Exizel Apr 09, 2016

The way you said it gives me the impression that you were talking about order and chaos in general and not the cast :mrgreen:

.

Based on the cast, I imagine the force of chaos in castle with brigther color and the force of order in castle with light color,so in this case the current castle doesn't really fit the force of chaos.

Troyen Apr 09, 2016

The map looks really cool and it'll be interesting to see the WW take on pokemon.

But this statement

We're thinking of course how to avoid "Lily/Ace must always be in party", since we want to give freedom. So an alternative could be that you can summon any unlocked creature, and the characters you choose will only influence the spells.

seems to conflict with this one:

Each individual creature should gain XP and level up in battle

in that it sounds like only the battle participants gain XP. So like with Loren 1, unless you spend a huge amount of time grinding all 72 romanceable pokemon up, you're probably just going to settle on your star team and stick with them. And that probably means the last summons you unlock would be the least used, since they're starting from a disadvantage. Unless there was some kind of "catchup" mechanic (e.g. half the stats are based on individual level, but half the stats are based on summoner level).

jack1974 Apr 09, 2016

I have to think about this, but an idea was to spend those resources to power up your creatures. There would be limits to stats based on level and so on, so you can't overpower your creatures. But I need to figure this out yet. Or simply the creatures all level at same time, or don't have any level up (easier solution haha).

DarkWolf Apr 09, 2016

I have to think about this, but an idea was to spend those resources to power up your creatures. There would be limits to stats based on level and so on, so you can't overpower your creatures. But I need to figure this out yet. Or simply the creatures all level at same time, or don't have any level up (easier solution haha).

I have a suggestion, you said that in battles those creatures that you used gain exp but you also gain some point that you can freely use to level up any of your creatures, now if those points where like medals you could make so that they too have levels and certain level monster would require certain level medals like in Final fantasy XIII-2. Lets say medals LV one can only be used to level up monsters up to level 5 medals LV two can be used for monsters lv 5-10 etc. that way even after you leveled up your preferred set of creatures you would still get points/medals that you can only use on other lover level creatures witch would result on them not staying too far behind. As for creatures you obtain later they could simply be higher LV from the start exactly like in pokemon games, the further in game you are the higher lv creatures would attack you and once you capture them they would be the same level as they where when you battled them. You could also make it so they have higher cap level or stronger skills so that players have more reason to want to change to creatures that they got letter in game. Another thing you could do is make creatures have some kind of stamina or cold down time witch would force players to use more then a single set of creatures and add more strategy to game as you would need to make a multiple set of creatures you change in between and calculate when what creatures to use. On top of that you could make so that creatures have weaknesses and strengths for elements witch would make it even more necessary to change creatures you use and on top of everything you could make it so that on certain missions you can only use certain characters and creatures. This system would make players want to more or less equally level up and use their creatures and draw full potential of creature collecting type of game.

jack1974 Apr 09, 2016

Yes I had already in mind the weakness system since I had picked the elements with that idea in mind (there are all the opposites, life vs death, fire vs water, etc). The other suggestions are good, I never played Final Fantasy XIII-2 though, I'll need to take a look at some youtube videos to understand that system

Troyen Apr 09, 2016

Maybe the leveling system could apply to global abilities. As a random example, instead of each creature having a level, their power is based on the level of the summoner (probably the MC). At low levels, the summons can't do a whole lot (maybe two moves), but leveling up your summoner gives access to more abilities (three, four, maybe even five per creature). Explained in game by the summoner's developing mastery.

Or, if that's too simplistic, break it down by element. Though I think if you want greater summon choice, you have to sacrifice disparate power between summons.

jack1974 Apr 10, 2016

Considering the creature amount I think will go max for 3 abilities each if not less. I cannot make a game with over 100+ abilities :lol:

(also because many would be just duplicates so wouldn't even be fun to play IMHO).

But yes anyway need to figure out a system for which you cannot have useless or underleveled minions, they should all be useful in battles somehow. This could also be simply done by limiting the type of copies to 1 (so you cannot summon 3 earth elementals in a battle) or stuff like this. Need to think more

jack1974 Dec 16, 2016

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CzyyOjnXgAMzP_q.jpg" style="max-width:100%">

today implemented the basic map

I decided to go on with this game, do the design, etc. Since I'm probably going to do some custom stuff, so not reuse any existing RPG system (I want to do some pseudo-realtime thing, at least try it) means I will try to do it all myself.

Let's see in a few months what I managed to produce :lol:

This also means that once the writer gets back to this game, if the gameplay is all done, should also be easier to integrate the story with it.

Franka Dec 16, 2016

(I want to do some pseudo-realtime thing, at least try it)

BOO!

Well, ok... I hope it pleases someone else. :wink:

jack1974 Dec 16, 2016

Sorry I wrote badly, I mean something that you can play either turn-based, or pseudo-realtime

But maybe my efforts will fail miserably!

Troyen Dec 17, 2016

so not reuse any existing RPG system (I want to do some pseudo-realtime thing, at least try it) means I will try to do it all myself.

Let's see in a few months what I managed to produce

That sounds interesting. I liked Loren when it came out, but even with the SotW and QoT changes, the systems feel very similar. Would be neat to see something radically different for a change of pace.

jack1974 Dec 17, 2016

Yes I think just having it auto-play with possibility to pause would make things very different already

jack1974 Dec 27, 2016

I'm taking it easier for now and doing the stuff around the combat itself :mrgreen:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C0rN9_rWQAE_TBL.jpg" style="max-width:100%">

when you choose a realm from the main map, you should get to a screen like the above (of course everything it's work in progress, at it's clearly missing stuff).

The idea is to have 12 FIXED story missions each realm, for a total of 72 battles (which should be enough I think) plus some random/skirmish ones in case your party/creatures aren't strong enough and you need to grind some XP. Like other games, in easy mode you'll probably not have to grind at all (unless you want to!) while in Nightmare or higher difficulties it will be required.

Winning battles will grant you some resources for each element. Most will be associated to the Realm, so in Fire Realm you'll collect mostly Fire Resources, but I'm also going to have multiple resources. The only rule will be that it can't be the opposite element (so you will never find Water Resources in Fire Realm for example).

The resources will be spent for making your creatures stronger, based on the element (Fire will work only on Fire creatures, and so on).

This should be the basic/core mechanics so far