the polygamy thread (SPOILERS!!!!)

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P_Tigras
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Re: the polygamy thread (SPOILERS!!!!)

Post by P_Tigras » Tue Apr 18, 2017 2:56 pm

Madance wrote:I think you have a lot of points,I mean... MAYBE the initial idea(at least this os the vibe I've got by seing the romance cg art but I could be mistaken) was to make 4 endings. One where Amber get together with only Reed(Light Plus), other with both of them(MAYBE Light), other with only Cosmina(Dark) and one with no one(Dark Plus). However, since is a Poly romance, they decided to change, but still used the same CG's.
Looking at the CG's only, it looks like:

Dark Plus: Amber is banished with a tearful Cosmina and Amber both looking devastated. Reed looks on with a slight frown.
Dark: Amber ends up alone sitting in a window which she gazes out of. Her face is not shown.
Light: Amber ends up with Cosmina. They gaze at each other adoringly as they hold hands and travel the world together.
Light Plus: Amber ends up marrying Reed. Cosmina does not appear to be at the wedding.
Threesome: Amber ends up getting both Cosmina and Reed, as they're all in bed together. (I know this isn't an ending, but none of the actual ending CG's show Amber ending up with both Cosmina and Reed.)

So the Dark Plus and Dark CG's make it look like Amber gets neither, the Light CG makes it look like Amber gets Cosmina, and the Light Plus CG makes it look like Amber gets Reed. Then there's the threesome CG where Amber gets both, but that's not an ending.
Now, let's talk about it story wise...

I think the king(I wish I knew their names so i can make a proper fanfic, but whatever)
The King and Queen of Icesilia's names are never mentioned in the story. Apparently their names are considered unimportant. But yes, I'd prefer that they'd have been named too.
let Amber to marry both of Reed and Cosmina out of pure amusement. He was too shocked with the fact that the Panacea actually worked to bother with the long consequences of this kind of marriage,
Whether or not the King reacts well to Amber's request to marry both Reed and Cosmina is fairly arbitrary. If you get the Light Plus ending he reacts well, while if you get the Dark ending, he reacts poorly and turns her down. This reminds me of why I disliked Bionic Hearts 2 so much. The endings were arbitrary and heavy-handed. The actions of the protagonist in the various endings didn't make sense to me, and often seemed contrary to the character's established personality. I much prefer it when a writer stays true to a character's personality and doesn't change the personality just to make something happen. After posting once or twice I entirely dropped out of the BH2 thread and mostly have confined myself to the RPG's section of this forum. Amber isn't anywhere near that bad, but I find this entire Dark Plus/Dark/Light/Light Plus mechanic artificial and contrived. I'm a firm believer in cause and effect, and allowing entirely unrelated decisions that the King will never witness nor learn about affect his decision to grant or deny Amber's request very seriously rubs me the wrong way.
and let's not forget that while Cosmina and Reed aren't directly related as a brother and sister, they probably are cousins(Since they are so alike, I would say first or second cousins); so depending on how the kindow views this kind of relation, it might be better to have a marriage between a Dark Elf and the prince than one between two cousins. After all, in the middle ages, this kind of thing was pretty common between most of the royalty, with a few exceptions to the rules.
Royal marriages between cousins were extremely common during the middle-ages, and given that they bend over backwards to make it very clear that they are from different branches of the same family and not that closely related, I think it's clear that they're not 1st cousins, and probably not even 2nd cousins. As for their looking alike, the game also makes it clear that all Geislar's have the same hair. It's a distinguishing trait of the family including its branches. Furthermore a marriage between the Royals means closer ties between Geislar and Icesilia, which is politically significant. I don't see what marriage to a tradeswoman like Amber adds politically speaking.
Regardless, what matters is, he might have thought that making the marriage between the prince and Amber not only he was paying the life debt that he owned to her, but also silencing his daughter and nephew insistent marriage request, giving another kind of gossip to the nobles to focus,
This would be out of the frying pan into the fire. I don't see why the King would prefer the fire over the frying pan. I get that the family would rather add new lands that aren't already in the family's keeping over simply strengthening and consolidating existing ties within the family. Nevertheless, at least the prince is of equal station to his daughter, and a public marriage between them would strengthen ties between their side of the family and the main branch. A marriage with Amber doesn't even give that. She's a tradeswoman with no family to speak of.

I just don't see why the King would screw his daughter and heir over with a private marriage. The in-game reasoning comes across as shallow and poorly thought out. It's incomprehensible, and ruins this ending for me. It should either be a double public marriage (this kingdom is supposed to be LGBT friendly according to Jack) or if there is an issue with the poly-thing, a public marriage between Cosmina and Reed (they're the royals with lands and powerful families!!!) followed by a private marriage where they bring Amber into their marriage and form a triad.
giving a good image for Icesilia as a tolerant nation and lastly,
A tolerant nation would accept a poly double marriage. There would be no need for a second private marriage. It makes it seem like the King's daughter and heir will be keeping her own marriage in the closet and that makes no sense. It not only disrespects the future Queen of Icesilia but opens up a giant can of political worms regarding the legitimacy of the Queen's marriage.
giving the oportunity to call off whatever issues the prince and princess might have with Amber at a later date without any trouble.
I don't understand this comment. Given the public marriage between the prince and Amber, I don't see how any issues he has can later be called off.
Another thing, let's not forget that the marriages were between Amber and Reed(public marriage) and Reed and Cosmina. There never wasn't one between Cosmina and Amber, and the dialog in the party while they were dancing, Amber ask if it she really wanted to dance with her, since people might find it troublesome. I don't know how they see LGBT's in Aravorn in general, but there might be some prejudice there...
Jack has already answered this question, so we'll go with his answer. Aravorn is LGBT friendly. I'm not sure if it's poly friendly as well, but if it wasn't, I don't see why the king would have even considered allowing Amber to marry both royals.
Last edited by P_Tigras on Tue Apr 18, 2017 4:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: the polygamy thread (SPOILERS!!!!)

Post by P_Tigras » Tue Apr 18, 2017 3:17 pm

jack1974 wrote:Yeah main issue was on my part for labeling them yuri, when it's clear that even the original/previous writer never intended them to be like that. I repeat myself again, but in future I'll be VERY careful to not make such mistakes (by mistake I mean labeling "wrong" a romance type, not that having poly route was a mistake in itself).

Also because I don't plan to get myself so burned out again in future :mrgreen:
Yes, I most definitely agree that it's never good to create expectations you aren't planning to meet, even accidentally. That can lead to large numbers of angry customers and bad reviews. I'm glad you're aware of that and taking action to avoid that giant pithole.

Nevertheless, my own point is that it wouldn't be a significant amount of work to make a yuri path for Cosmina given what's already there. Having looked at all of her dialogue, I'm fairly certain I could knock out the writing in a single weekend. In fact, if it were possible to --legally-- distribute a community-mod for the game, just as we once used to do for Neverwinter Nights and the first Dragon Age, I'd probably write it at this point.

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Re: the polygamy thread (SPOILERS!!!!)

Post by jack1974 » Tue Apr 18, 2017 3:29 pm

I'm not sure, you should rewrite in practice all the adult scenes, so 5, plus the endings. I don't know the adult amount but the whole Cosmina path was about 24k words, so you should write 12k words. Not so easy I think :)

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Re: the polygamy thread (SPOILERS!!!!)

Post by Madance » Tue Apr 18, 2017 3:50 pm

P_Tigras wrote:
jack1974 wrote:Yeah main issue was on my part for labeling them yuri, when it's clear that even the original/previous writer never intended them to be like that. I repeat myself again, but in future I'll be VERY careful to not make such mistakes (by mistake I mean labeling "wrong" a romance type, not that having poly route was a mistake in itself).

Also because I don't plan to get myself so burned out again in future :mrgreen:
Yes, I most definitely agree that it's never good to create expectations you aren't planning to meet, even accidentally. That can lead to large numbers of angry customers and bad reviews. I'm glad you're aware of that and taking action to avoid that giant pithole.

Nevertheless, my own point is that it wouldn't be a significant amount of work to make a yuri path for Cosmina given what's already there. Having looked at all of her dialogue, I'm fairly certain I could knock out the writing in a single weekend. In fact, if it were possible to --legally-- distribute a community-mod for the game, just as we once used to do for Neverwinter Nights and the first Dragon Age, I'd probably write it at this point.
If you could make this come true, I would be the first in line to try it XD

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Re: the polygamy thread (SPOILERS!!!!)

Post by jack1974 » Tue Apr 18, 2017 3:58 pm

I stand corrected, you should rewrite only from scene7 to the end. So yes much less than I thought (sorry if you already explained that, but hadn't time to read everything).

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Re: the polygamy thread (SPOILERS!!!!)

Post by Madance » Tue Apr 18, 2017 4:15 pm

jack1974 wrote:I stand corrected, you should rewrite only from scene7 to the end. So yes much less than I thought (sorry if you already explained that, but hadn't time to read everything).
Well, if we all waited patiently for almost 4 years for the yuri version of the UNSPEAKABLE CURSED GAME to come out, to wait a few more months for the rewritten dialog of the Cosmina path would be a walk in the beach in comparison XD

But really, at this point, I'm just chilling here, I loved the character, regardless of anything.

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Re: the polygamy thread (SPOILERS!!!!)

Post by P_Tigras » Tue Apr 18, 2017 4:17 pm

Hmmm...scene 7 (the love scene) is 2,577 words. That would be the most significant rewrite. There is a 1,831 word section of scene 9 (troll hunting pda) that needs some serious editing. I'd probably want to add a few hundred words to the ending scene as well. The alterations to the rest would be trivial. Scene 6 already has a date scene with just Cosmina. I'd just need to edit the logic determining which date she goes on. Scenes 8 and 10 can be left virtually as is, a handful of word removals for the Cosmina path are all that's required. My estimate is 5k, plus or minus 0.5k, so between 4.5k and 5.5k words total.
Last edited by P_Tigras on Tue Apr 18, 2017 4:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: the polygamy thread (SPOILERS!!!!)

Post by P_Tigras » Tue Apr 18, 2017 4:26 pm

Madance wrote:
P_Tigras wrote:
jack1974 wrote:Yeah main issue was on my part for labeling them yuri, when it's clear that even the original/previous writer never intended them to be like that. I repeat myself again, but in future I'll be VERY careful to not make such mistakes (by mistake I mean labeling "wrong" a romance type, not that having poly route was a mistake in itself).

Also because I don't plan to get myself so burned out again in future :mrgreen:
Yes, I most definitely agree that it's never good to create expectations you aren't planning to meet, even accidentally. That can lead to large numbers of angry customers and bad reviews. I'm glad you're aware of that and taking action to avoid that giant pithole.

Nevertheless, my own point is that it wouldn't be a significant amount of work to make a yuri path for Cosmina given what's already there. Having looked at all of her dialogue, I'm fairly certain I could knock out the writing in a single weekend. In fact, if it were possible to --legally-- distribute a community-mod for the game, just as we once used to do for Neverwinter Nights and the first Dragon Age, I'd probably write it at this point.
If you could make this come true, I would be the first in line to try it XD
Maybe Jack and I can work something out. We'll see what he wants to do. :wink:

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Re: the polygamy thread (SPOILERS!!!!)

Post by Madance » Tue Apr 18, 2017 4:29 pm

Maybe Jack and I can work something out. We'll see what he wants to do. :wink:[/quote]



YEEEEEES! *Do a silly little mad dance XD* THANKS P_Tigras SENPAI and Jack SAMA! :mrgreen:

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Re: the polygamy thread (SPOILERS!!!!)

Post by SimonStardust » Tue Apr 18, 2017 5:09 pm

(Note to myself: Don't start proofreading Cosmina's route just yet.)
:lol: :lol: :lol:
Beware! Peerons ahead! xD

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